01-22-92 Planning Commission MINCITY OF OTSEGO PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES OF 1-22-92 AT 7PM
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MEMBERS PRESENT:
ING ROSKAFT
KATHY LEWIS
COUNCIL PRESENT:
DOUG LINDENFELSER
FLOYD RODEN
STAFF PRESENT:
DAVE LICHT
CARL SWENSON JIM KOLLES
MARK WALLACE 7:55PM BRUCE RASK
RONALD G BLACK
LARRY FOURNIER
ELAINE BEATTY
NORMAN F FRESKE
JERRY PERRAULT,
CLERK
JUDY HUDSON
Roskaft called the meeting to order at 7:10PM. He then
turned the meeting over to Licht. Licht told the residents
that the Thiltgen Hearing is noticed for 8PM and legally we
will Hear it at 8PM. He stated we can go over the Ordinances
until 8PM and then have the Public Hearing.
Licht went over the Ordinances and said it was provided
to everyone to take time to review it. We need to go over
the Ordinance in place. It can always change later. Licht
identified 14 items in a memo he would like to go over with
the Planning Commission.
1. Pg 82 - Single Family detached dwelling regulations:
A summary is that a single •family property is allowed an
accessary building without any special permits or approvals
of 750 square ft, with potential of up to 1,000 square feet
without approval. Total accessory space can reach total of
1500 square feet. Is this acceptable? It was agreeable.
2. Pg #85 -- a concern on swimming pools is a major
concern with a temporary swimming pool, is it regulated by
the Ordinance? Answer is no. It is not regulated (we have
added in permanent construction.
3. Pg #87 - Item F: Fencing Section - A-1 and A-2
it should read on line #2. The concern was having an
electric fence as a line fence.
Roskaft asked about survey for fence. Is it necessary?
Licht said neighborhood disputes usually surface because of
it. Could we put in the Ordinance where a property is
Certificate of Surveyed, with survey posts in the ground,
that those would not have to be surveyed over. Beatty asked
about permitting fences. Are we going to have them get a
Building Permit. We haven't in the past. Licht said if you
require a permit the fence is put in properly. Permits are
required only in platted areas, not hobby farms or rural farm
areas. Another thing we need to look at is how do we
approach the change in zoning? We won't change what is there
today, because there is a potential of so many issues that
need to be addressed, you can adopt the Ordinance and what is
there is legal now and after the Ordinance is in place(Licht)
4. Pg 106 - D. Pole Buildings Dave Licht read this
information. Many times, as a small business comes in they
will propose a pole building. Your first commercial
buildings will characterize the community and what you allow
CITY OF OTSEGO PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES OF 1-22-92 AT 7PM
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and how you want it to look.
Pg 111. Deals with restrictions for single family
owners. In essence, not to allow manufactured homes to
develop anywhere in the City. Only in mobile home areas.
The main intent is to have mobile homes within a mobile home
district. Otsego is unique in that it has this style of
development called a mobile home subdivision. Wright Co. has
classified mobile homes as a non -conforming use and 1992 or
so must be removed if not in a mobile home zoned area. This
is not in our ordinance. Licht said he has a hard time saying
somebody has to leave their house. You may want a provision
to put in a limit of the amortization period, three or four
years beyond the County.
Roskaft said there are some mobile homes that are not
being kept up and they (County) can step in and clean them
up, etc.
Pg 114. Model Homes and Subdivisions:
Allow a permit from the City Council. (interim use)
mobile home is reviewed and allowed to be established. You
regulate it as a Commercial use, etc.
I
Pg. #117 - Item F - Says in a residential zoned areas
there is a limitation of pounds for vehicles allowed, etc.
Pg.#137: We have a mining ordinance and this is in
addition to that mining ordinance.
Pg.#141. Farms - What we have said is that on family
farm, farming is allowed. Building Permits are required on
farms and commercial feed lots require permits (PCA
regulated). For accessory dwellings, we used what the County
had and reiterated what the Council had approved. It is an
interim use. This gives us police power.
Pg #142 Home Extended Businesses 20-26-7:
We have allowed the seasonal sale of farm products. We have
allowed that also to be done on farms in other districts,
with a Cond. Use Permit which would be a blanket permit for a
period of time.
Pg #144 Animals - We have gone to fairly specific and
limited regulations contained in the Zoning Ord. We have
addressed kennels and farm animals have been addressed.
Community riding stables are addressed (5 -horses or more for
commercial purposes). Rather than to get into all the
various types of regulations, we tried to do is that any
animal that is not classified and defined as a farm animal,
or domestic animal, needs to come thru a Cond. Use Permit
process. It will allow us to check the State Statutes.
Pg #155. Home Extended Businesses:
We tried to incorporate a number of factors that were
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previously discussed, unless it is in the A-1 district, it is
not allowed. We have classified interim uses for
Ag/Commercial/Industrial Zoning areas Illegal, non -conforming
business (No permit from the County or they have a permit,
but exceeded the permit limits) owner/operator has sixty days
CITY OF OTSEGO PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES OF 1-22-92 AT 7PM
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to file for permit after being identified by the City,
before we would say you have the ability to qualify for
interim use.
Pg #156. The requirements are listed from Wright County
Regulations. The City has the right on how long that
business can be maintained. You have potential, per city
decision, of up to ten years to have that business for case
by case evaluation. Ten years from the date of this
ordinance, the business is gone.
Pg 158. Interim Use in Residential Zoning District
(5 years limit) because it is within an area that is
expanding.
Pg 159 - Illegal non -conforming uses (Residential
District) 20-29-5 allowed Home Extended Business by
Conditional Use Permit. We reiterate the County standard if
there were two complaints or violations noted, it can be
removed.
P9 #161 - Daycare Nurseries - Should not be allowed in a
residential area. It may take special concerns or
requirements.
Rask felt he views it as a money making business. Most
people work in this community. Bottom line it is a business,
not out of the goodness of their hearts. Licht said we are
dealing with the care of children in excess of 12. There may
be 12 screeming kids out there from 8AM on. School with 100
or so kids in a residential area is a welcome situation.
Churches will open to day care_ The State views it as a Home
Occupation and the City does permit it. A Home Extended
Business as a machine shop has truck deliveries, oil and
pollution, etc. Swenson said he shares the same concern. It
appears to be an exception and why are we looking at this?
Licht compares it to a School, you compare it to a Home
Extended Business said Licht. As long as the State allows
for up to 12 children, the State will take care of that.
8PM #6. MARK AND LINDA THILTGEN - PID #118-030-000010,
Lots 1, 2, 42 and 43 of Riverside Park, Twp 121, Range 23,
Wright Co Mn, it the City of Otsego. Request is for a 300
square feet addition onto their house which is located at
10003 Parrish Ave NE, directly abutting the Mississippi
River. Applicants are requesting a Cond Use Permit for
location of a residential use within a Floodplain overlay and
Wild and Scenic Zoning District of the City. A Variance is
also being requested because the subject site fails to meet
minimum lot size requirements, although it is currently a
legal non -conforming use. The four lots need to be combined.
Licht presented the request and said it appears to be a
relatively minor and the applicant has been put thru a lot of
time and trouble on this. The floodplain area they are in
the Mississippi River Corridor, subject to stringent area
regulations. The City becomes concerned that it meet the
particular regulations. The DNR, Dale Homuth has indicated
CITY OF OTSEGO PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES OF 1-22-92 AT 7PM
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the Cond. Use Permit and Variance acceptability on their
part, and we are also recommending approval. Lot size and
lot width is at issue. What is recommended is three
conditions be attached to the recommendation for approval.
Local requirement is there are four lots that comprise the
site. at minimum, what we are looking at is that those four
sites have to be legally combined into one parcel. At issue
is how it will be achieved and the City Council needs to take
this up as a policy matter. It will not hold up the building
permit on this addition. This refers to NAC's report of 7,
January, 1992. Licht said the applicants are here. He noted
that there has been property owners in that area that have
been precluded from development. This does meet the
requirements. It was noted by Roskaft that the proper
notices were sent out and the posting and publishing was
done. There were no comments from the audience. Licht
stated that their combined lots equal 30,000 square feet.
Their house is not as far towards the river as the
neighboring houses. They have consolidated.
LEWIS motioned to recommend approval of the Cond. Use
Permit and Variance for Linda and Mark Thiltgen with the
conditions listed below from NAC's Report, and with the
exception that the City Council would approve the policy
matter of combining of the lots. Swenson seconded the
motion. All agreed. (THIS WILL PUT ON COUNCIL AGENDA 1-27-
92)
SUMMARY OF CONDITIONS:
1. The addition is properly elevated, banked with fill
and certified by a registered engineer or architect.
2. The four existing lots are combined into one
contiguous parcel and approved by the Zoning Administrator.
3. The existing well and septic system are reviewed by
the DNR and City Engineer to ensure proper functioning.
4. That the Otsego City Council will approve the policy
matter of combining of the lots.
Next on Agenda was the approval of Minutes of 1-8-92.
Lewis said she would like to see added to page 6 a
clarification to the minutes of "Ag" in the middle of the
page.
Rask motioned to approve the minutes with the above
correction of 1-8-92. Jim Kolles seconded the motion.
Motion carried unanimously.
Next on Agenda was the election of officers:
Ron Black was asked to handle the election by Chair Ing
Roskaft.
SECRETARY NOMINATIONS:
Lewis motioned to nominate James Kolles. There were no
other nominations. Vote was taken and all were in favor of
James Kolles for the Secretary position.
VICE -CHAIRPERSON NOMINATIONS: Wallace nominated Lewis.
Lewis nominated Roskaft.
CITY OF OTSEGO PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES OF 1-22-92 AT 7PM-
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Nominations were called closed. Vote was by secret ballot.
Councilman Roden counted votes.
RESULTS FOR VICE -CHAIRPERSON WERE:
LEWIS 4
ROSKAFT 2
Lewis received the Vice --Chairperson seat.
NOMINATIONS FOR CHAIRPERSON=
Rask nominated Swenson, Wallace nominated Roskaft.
Nominations closed. Voting was by secret ballot. Councilman
Roden tabulated.
RESULTS FOR CHAIRPERSON=
SWENSON 5
ROSKAFT 1
Swenson received the Chairperson seat_
Roskaft relinquished the Chairperson job to Swenson.
Swenson gave a vote of thanks to Roskaft for the last two
years of Chairperson job.
P.C. then continued on with the Daycare
Licht stated we are saying single family or multiple dwelling
area. Roskaft said he would lean toward the Commercial area
for daycare facilities. Lewis said she thinks the Daycare is
more desirable than having three homes around you having up
to three kids. I am not for sure that these don't belong in
a residential area with the permit process. If allowed, they
have to go thru a Cond. Use Permit said Rask. His only
concern is it is a great resource for a big income. I am not
sympathetic towards a place for kids to be watched. They are
not doing it out of the goodness of their hearts. Black
asked if this would permit a person who wants to go into
business as a daycare operation to purchase a home and make
it a daycare operation? It would be allowed as a CUP if
allowed. There are stipulations if the Council and Planning
Commission would determine that the area is in too close
proximity to other residential. It could be determined. It
has to meet State Specs. It would be a controlled size of a
special building in a residential area. The State
regulations control it. You have control of zoning
compatibility issues to address. Much discussion was had on
daycare facilities.
Swenson asked for any other questions. What is your
pleasure? Leave it or change it?
Lewis said it sounds like it gives the City a reasonable
amount of control. Rask said he is comfortable with it.
Roskaft felt 50 to 100 children should be in a Commercial
area, he can't see the compatibility of a special structure
being built as long as up to 12 children can be regulated
under the State. The consensus was leave it as it is.
Pg #173 Wind Energy Conversion Systems
The question is, you can have them on any property if
Ag/Commercial/Ind or at least 5A in size.(Fi.l.e PC12492)
{ y CITY OF OTSEGO PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES OF 1-22-92 AT 7PM
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Rask said you can have solar and it is an alternative
use for electricity. The concern is an extremely tall
structure for a 1A lot said Licht. Rask said if we can't
have these, I would like to get rid of solar collectors also
in residential areas. Licht said there is a danger of
children climbing and children falling, where solar panels
may not be as attractive as some people prefer you have to
have height regulations. That does not get into the public
safety issue like wind energy. Black wondered if you can't
accomplish the same thing in a different manner? Isn't our
objective accomplished if you say anybody can have one, but
it has to be installed so if it falls, it falls on your own
yard. Licht said it is an attractive nuisance and relates to
the character in an area you are trying to create. Black
said he has a problem with that because if a guy has a ham
radio he can put up a big tower. Roskaft said the question
he has in his mind is "is the tower collapsable?" Licht said
for ham radio operators, if you have a ground mounted system,
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there limit is 15' height by Cond. Use Permit you can have
that go up. You can go 6-1/2' above the roof of the house.
j
Black asked if this precludes a water pumping windmill?
i
Licht said not if it is in a height limit.
Swenson had a question on Pg. 11 - definitions. (N-1).
Licht said it is taken directly from the uniform building
codes.
SIGN REGULATIONS:
Clem Darkenwald was here when we discussed this the last
time. We proposed to compare the Darkenwald Project #42 and
#101 with the existing ordinance and new ordinance. In a
summary, the freestanding sign is approximately 12' too high.
The County Ordinance does not recognize multiple signage.
There is a violation with portable sign and banners. (See
attached report from NAC. He was concerned that existing
signs would be non -conforming. It was built with a permit,
it is existing and there are not that many signs in the
Commercial area now. Our feeling was that it is not a
significant enough problem to get into it. We have revised
that Ordinance to let this sign exist. If it is blown over
or in a tornado, then it ceases to exist and at that point it
should be brought into compliance. Twenty feet is the height
of the Commercial signs, per John Darkenwalds question. Elk
River has 28 to 30 -something for sign heights said
(�
Darkenwald. It is a judgment call said Licht. You regulate
it by sign height and number of signs. Darkenwald felt 20'
JJ j -.�
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is too low. More discussion was had on signs.
P!g 207-A Motor Fuel Station ( Signs) - Licht read this
and explained. John Darkenwald said he didn't feel they
should have any regulations on what people put in their
windows. I can't allow. You would be less than the
communities around you. Licht said we are trying to allow
identification without.clutter. Darkenwald said depending on
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location. Wally O'Dell asked why in the context of the sign
ordinance, what is the good of fixing a specific height?
Licht said public safety is fundamental. A sign has a
function. Much more explai nation was given. Licht referred
to Crystal sign ordinance and Bass Lake Road and the sea of
signs. You are talking of a rural area, not urban and nrot
that much commercial potential, said Darkenwald. Licht
discussed signs and his experience with signs. It was n 4oted
that billboard signs are prohibited. Present shorelands
regulations allow a maximum building height of 25'. The
shorelands regulations do have to go thru the DNR. The ether
thing is the DNR proceedure for lake front or riverfont -lots.
A vast majority of the Cities do not allow these Lots. Right
now those are not allowed in the Ordinance. You either have
riparian rights or you don't.
Roskaft brought up Pg 2 - C typo
Pg 62, A & B ( should read any)
29.E-7 Partywall (why?) It is a property line fire wall
and is a building code description.
f Licht said the ordinance distributed tonight is
Boilerplate DNR and if Otsego has more strict regulation, it.
applies. The State will tell you what applies.
Lewis brought up #4 on the agenda by-laws, length o -F
terms, procedure for applications and appointment. Swenson
said he has been thinking about that too.
Swenson had some by-laws from Apple Valley and the estate
Planning Commission has recommended by-laws. Swenson
recommended a sub -committee to go over this information and
recommend it to the Council. Lewis said she will be willing
to work on it. Wallace would volunteer also. Swenson said
he would set in if they wish. In the next couple of
meetings, maybe something can be gotten ready.
Licht said lst meeting in February they will be her �
with Zoning Maps. After mid February, you are ready for an
informational meeting. Licht said he felt it should be held
at the Elk River School.
Lewis motioned to have an informational meeting on 2-19-
92 at 7:30PM at the school in Elk River. Wallace seconds d
the motion. All agreed. Beatty will check with Community Ed
to see if school is available. ( It will be at 7:30 2-19-92
at Vandenberge Jr. Hi School, which is the next school W of
the High School - Use the East entrance closest to the HILgh
School.
Roskaft motioned to adjourn. Wallace seconded the
motion. Motion carried unanimously.
JAMES R LES, SECRETA Y
BY: Elaine Beatty, Recording Secretary
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