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04-19-99 PCCITY OF OTSEGO PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING APRIL 19, 1999 - 8PM MINUTES 1. Chair Carl Swenson will call meeting to order: Carl Swenson, Chair called the meeting to order at 8PM. ROLL ALL: P.C.: Chair Carl Swenson, Bruce Rask, Gene Goenner, Jim Kolles, Arleen Nagel, Richard Nichols. Patrick Moonen, Excused Absence. Christian Mbanefo, alternate absent. Council: Mayor Larry Fournier, Vern Heidner, Virginia Wendel, Suzanne Ackerman and Mark Berning. Staff: Mike Robertson, City .Administrator, Elaine Beatty, City Clerk/Zoning Administrator, Larry Koshak, City Engineer, Dan Licht, City Planner. 2. Consideration of the Planning Commission Minutes of: A. April 5. 1999 ARLEEN NAGEL MOTIONED TO APPROVE THE MINUTES OF APRIL 5, 1999 AS WRITTEN. RICHARD NICHOLS SECONDED THE MOTION. MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. 3 Public Hearing for Ulmer Construction, Inc, Dennis Ulmer "Prairie Creek Sketch Plan Review, (Note: Ulmer Application is incomplete - Sketch Plan Review only - No action necessary by the P.C. - See Attached Info.) Property is located in Section 27 Twp 121, Range 23, City of Otsego 8019 fiver Road NE Edmond N and Mariette LeFebvre, owner of record. PID #118-500-271100 80 Acres and PID #118-500-224401, 2.65 acres in Section 22, Twp 121, Range 23 Randal N LeFebvre and M. Matheny, owners of record. Dennis Ulmer, of Ulmer Construction, Inc., Matt Davich, and Charles Plowe were present. Mr. Ulmer noted that he has been a land developer and home builder for 25 years. He noted the City has put a lot of work into future planning. They want their plan to be a complement to the City's plan. Mr. Plowe said they have worked hard to prepare a plan without straight streets. The School property to the North doesn't allow a street connection in that direction. The ditch restricts the street from going in the direction needed and the drainage needs to work around the developed areas. The lots meet or exceed minimum lot size. The proposed town homes will be in a future phase. Twci homes and single family mixed together is not something they prefer. The separation of the two areas will work better. There is a proposed connection between the two with a pathway and bridge for pedestrian traffic from the single family area to the town homes. The number of cul-de- sacs is due to the site constrictions. They can incorporate a pathway for foot traffic to get to the school. The collector street (78TH ST.) completion date is important to them. Richard Nichols - Do you have any preliminary redesign to take some of the cul- de-sacs out? Mr. Davich - We have shortened cul-de-sacs and looked at other alternatives such as pushing one through to the West. We feel this is a superior design that is pleasing, safer and fits the site better. Richard Nichols - According to the staff report, in twin home development.,lot size CITY OF OTSEGO PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES OF APRIL 19, 1999 AT 8PM - PAGE 2 - should be double of the minimum lot size. He questioned aesthetics. Mr. Davich - We are limited by the shape of the lot and stormwater ponding required. Dennis is not sure how the townhomes will lay out. He wants some flexibility for the future with regard to the townhomes. He is not ready yet for the finished product. He feels this is a realistic density. Mr. Ulmer noted that he wishes to get feedback from the Planning Commission. His schedule is 44 single family lots as the first phase. He hopes to final plat this phase in 1999. He would like to see the City build 78TH ST. this year. Gene Goenner - Is there a way to assure the next development won't be piling traffic on to Mr. Ulmer's streets if there is a connection to the West? Mr. Licht explained - The concern is neighborhood flow of traffic. I don't think long term traffic will be a problem. 78TH ST. and Page will be constructed as collector streets as the plats develop. Gene Goenner - I see 6- cul-de-sacs in a residential area of the plat. My opinion is it is excessive. Maybe change the cul-de-sacs to run through. I would like to see less cul- de-sacs. Dennis Ulmer - This is a large parcel of land. The land to the West would be compelled to have cul-de-sacs as well I would guess. I can see eliminating the one to the NW. If we have another connection to the West we start to dice things up there. Bruce Rask - If we construct 78TH ST., my concern is the development will have two entrances, one on Quaday and one on County Road #42. Is our loss of six lots worth the snowplowing of cul-de-sacs? Lets not let cul-de-sacs scare us away. Mr. Ulmer - We want a residential neighborhood, no traffic collection from the other neighborhoods. We feel it is a safe neighborhood plat. Mr. Robertson - Bruce Rask brings up a good point, we have directed the developer to keep street entrances to a minimum on collector streets. Mr. Licht - We have identified a through street and Rick Packer agrees they can accommodate it to the NW. Mr. Rask asked about phasing. Dan Licht explained that the entire parcel would be preliminary plat and then final plat in phases as they plan to develop. Mr. Licht noted that each P.C. member should comment on the street layout design. Gene Goenner and Bruce Rask noted they had already commented. Mr. Nichols - It's a nice looking development. I like the plan. If there is someway to cut down cul-de- sacs I would like to see that. If not possible, we would work with that. Jim Kolles - Preliminary Plat looks good. Arleen Nagel - Plan looks good. I like the development, but would like a connection to the West. Mr. Ulmer agreed to make the connection to the next plat. Chair Swenson - Did not feel that two connections to the West would make a racetrack out of it. He liked the layout, but felt it had too many cul-de-sacs. It was noted that Mr. Ulmer was invited to a Staff Meeting on Thursday at 10:30AM along with the developer to the West, Mr. Packer. CITY OF OTSEGO PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES OF APRIL 19, 1999 AT 8PM - PAGE 3 - Diane Seebeck - 8160 NE River Road. I am concerned for residents in cul-de-sacs you want to eliminate. What's the difference if I drive through my development or 78TH ST? I agree the developers should get together and look at plats. 4 Discussion of Otsego Subdivision Ordinance Re• Septic System Sites. Mr. Licht noted that at the last meeting the P.C. asked for the original language which he provided. He noted that the City Engineer is here to answer questions. Mr. Koshak noted that the 23,000 sq. ft requirement is a flexible item and should reflect the soils, and wetlands of the proposed development. It can include the home, but not necessarily. It assures that on a lot you have adequate space for a sewer, well, and a buildable area. FHA and VA Mortgages require that the first floor has to be 3 or 4 feet above the high water table, on original soil (Not filled soil). Mr. Robertson - Before we can accept a plat, they have to prove that there is room for 2 -septic sites. Is that the intent of the P.C.? Mr. Goenner - We have to have 23,000 sq. ft. of undisturbed soil? I hope the intent is two septic sites on each parcel. With 23,000 sq. ft. or more extensive testing should be their option. Mr. Rask questioned what if all are developments are disturbed soil. Mr. Koshak explained and more discussion was had about mound systems. Mr. Rask noted we already base it on soils evaluation, now we say set aside sites for septic. Much more discussion of Mr. Nichols - You have to re -write to say what you really mean as there is some language missing. More discussion. It was decided that Dan Licht will rework the language and bring it back now that they know the intent. 5. Any other P.C. Business a Vern Heidner - Council update Mr. Heidner noted that the Havel CUP and the Knutson CUP Amendment passed at the last Council Meeting. The Council exempted Bulow/Greninger land from the Moritorium - The Greninger's waived their feedlot reciprocal setback rights. At the Board of Review they found out that lots are selling for $50 to $75,000 in Lin -Bar and Heritage Hills Developments. Mr. Robertson explained his memo pertaining to Bulow Development and Park & Recreation Commission wants park land, not park fees. 6 Adjourn by IOPM BRUCE RASK MOTIONED TO ADJOURN THE P.C. MEETING. GENE GOENNER SECONDED THE MOTION. MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. MEETING ADJOURNED AT 10:10PM. AI&EEN NAGEL, skakEi7ARY Minutes By: Elaine Beatty, City Clerk/Recording Secretary eb File: 99PC459M.WPS